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troll · (This post was last modified: 02-03-2013 11:01 PM by troll.)

Your RP Name: Ryan Vance

Their RP Name: Sonny Corleone
Their SteamID: STEAM_0:0:35808568

Date of Incident: February 2, 2013
Time of Incident: 21:00
Time-zone: GMT -8.0

Please explain exactly what happened from start to finish:
Sonny entered my home to sell me a shipment of sg552 and two rifle ammo shipments. After he begin to leave where I let him through one door and at my front door I noticed a cp and citizen arguing on my property blocking my door so he could not get out. After twice of asking them to leave I killed them. Sonny who was behind me at this time immediatly pulled his gun and shot me. He claims he 'feared for his life'. I made a rdm report but no one answered to it but I got Ryladine to tp to me. During the time Sonny insisted that I was a moron and he knew the rules much better than me because he was a super admin. He also kept physgunning me and waving me in the air while we were trying to sort things out... he was just been very hostile about the entire thing. It was rdm because I was defending my property, I gave warning before I shot the cp and citizen. He is just using 'I feared for my life' as a reason to kill someone. If his "I feared for my life" logic worked for everyone... imagine a shootout on main street that happens all the time. People would use this just to kill and I know it isn't allowed. So it he shouldn't be doing it either.

Additional Evidence:

This all took place in my home.

Sonny · 02-03-2013, 11:18 PM

(02-03-2013 10:59 PM)troll Wrote: Your RP Name: Ryan Vance

Their RP Name: Sonny Corleone
Their SteamID: STEAM_0:0:35808568

Date of Incident: February 2, 2013
Time of Incident: 21:00
Time-zone: GMT -8.0

Please explain exactly what happened from start to finish:
Sonny entered my home to sell me a shipment of sg552 and two rifle ammo shipments. After he begin to leave where I let him through one door and at my front door I noticed a cp and citizen arguing on my property blocking my door so he could not get out. After twice of asking them to leave I killed them. Sonny who was behind me at this time immediatly pulled his gun and shot me. He claims he 'feared for his life'. I made a rdm report but no one answered to it but I got Ryladine to tp to me. During the time Sonny insisted that I was a moron and he knew the rules much better than me because he was a super admin. He also kept physgunning me and waving me in the air while we were trying to sort things out... he was just been very hostile about the entire thing. It was rdm because I was defending my property, I gave warning before I shot the cp and citizen. He is just using 'I feared for my life' as a reason to kill someone. If his "I feared for my life" logic worked for everyone... imagine a shootout on main street that happens all the time. People would use this just to kill and I know it isn't allowed. So it he shouldn't be doing it either.

Additional Evidence:

This all took place in my home.

I never said I knew the rules much better than you just because I'm an SA. I said I think I know the rules sarcastically. You had me trapped in a small confined space, in which you pull out a large firearm and shoot 2 people. I was trying to leave before and I did not see any viable way to leave, your fading door was inconspicuous and uneasy to spot to me at the time. I wasn't behind you, I was beside you. Like I said before, I didn't hear you on say anything on mic, and I don't think they did either because they just kept arguing, and I picked you up and waved you because EVERY TIME I opened my mouth to say something you started shouting over me about how I'm just Sonny and that is why I wanted to kill you.

troll · 02-03-2013, 11:33 PM

I did not shout... you were the one shouting, I was calm unlike you.

Sonny · 02-03-2013, 11:40 PM

Maybe you just have a mic that makes it sound like your yelling then.

Hail · 02-04-2013, 01:40 AM

if ry was there why wasnt it handled?

Sonny · 02-04-2013, 01:46 AM

It was, he just doesn't want to take the fact that it's really not decisive when he tries to twist the story around, and it's just plane and simple that I shot him because I was in fear for my life. He only made this because he saw the other abuse report on me and figured he'd jump on the band wagon. It is the same old shit, different day.

Burnacid · 02-04-2013, 07:46 AM

Did any of the conversation take place in chat?

troll · 02-04-2013, 07:48 AM

I only used my mic to talk to the cp/citizen and when ry tped to me.

Burnacid · 02-04-2013, 08:10 AM

Not much was typed

Code:

Sun Feb 3 7:47:27    kill        Ryan Vance (STEAM_0:0:15264714) was killed by Sonny Corleone (STEAM_0:0:35808568), weapon: weapon_pist_deagle

Sun Feb 3 7:47:46            Ryan Vance (STEAM_0:0:15264714) created issue #83: RDM Report: sonny rdmed me when i was killing two trespassers

Killer: Sonny Corleone [gundealer] (STEAM_0:0:35808568)

NOTE: The killer is a member of staff. Assosciated Player: Sonny Corleone (STEAM_0:0:35808568)

Sun Feb 3 7:47:49    chat        [911][CP] Sonny Corleone (STEAM_0:0:35808568): Stuck in Ryan Vances house after he killed a cop and I killed him

Sun Feb 3 7:47:51    chat        [PM][Reagent Baggins (STEAM_0:1:39698692)]->[Ryan Vance (STEAM_0:0:15264714)]: Sonny just reported you to 911 for buying a gun

Sun Feb 3 7:48:06    chat        [OOC] Ryan Vance (STEAM_0:0:15264714): why did u kill me sonny?

Sun Feb 3 7:48:07    chat        [YELL] Sonny Corleone (STEAM_0:0:35808568): HELP SOMEONE HELP

Sun Feb 3 7:48:18    chat        [OOC] Sonny Corleone (STEAM_0:0:35808568): I feared for my life after you shot a cop infront of me

Sun Feb 3 7:48:27    chat        [OOC] Ryan Vance (STEAM_0:0:15264714): that is no excuse sonny

Sun Feb 3 7:48:41    chat        [OOC] Ryan Vance (STEAM_0:0:15264714): they were trespassing, i said twice over mike to leave and they dident

Sun Feb 3 7:48:47    misc        Reagent Baggins (STEAM_0:1:39698692) checked Ryan Vance (STEAM_0:0:15264714)'s weapons.

Sun Feb 3 7:48:52    chat        [OOC] Ryladine Vividari (STEAM_0:1:19025450): Reagent, piss off

Sun Feb 3 7:48:54    chat        [OOC] Sonny Corleone (STEAM_0:0:35808568): You shot a cop infront of me, plain and simple

Sun Feb 3 7:48:58    chat        [OOC] Ryladine Vividari (STEAM_0:1:19025450): You're really annoying.

Sun Feb 3 7:48:59            Sonny Corleone (STEAM_0:0:35808568) kicked Reagent Baggins (STEAM_0:1:39698692) (fucking minge).

Sun Feb 3 7:49:04    chat        [PM][Ryan Vance (STEAM_0:0:15264714)]->[Ryladine Vividari (STEAM_0:1:19025450)]: this really was rdm

Sun Feb 3 7:49:14    chat        [911][CP] Sonny Corleone (STEAM_0:0:35808568): trapped in Ryan Vances House

Sun Feb 3 7:49:21    chat        [OOC] Sonny Corleone (STEAM_0:0:35808568): I know :)

Sun Feb 3 7:49:22    chat        [PM][Ryladine Vividari (STEAM_0:1:19025450)]->[Ryan Vance (STEAM_0:0:15264714)]: if it was staff will hande it, put in a request.

Sun Feb 3 7:49:40    chat        [PM][Ryan Vance (STEAM_0:0:15264714)]->[Ryladine Vividari (STEAM_0:1:19025450)]: i did, no one is answering, sonny blatantly rdmemd me in my oqwn home

Sun Feb 3 7:50:07    chat        [PM][Ryladine Vividari (STEAM_0:1:19025450)]->[Ryan Vance (STEAM_0:0:15264714)]: He's being questioned in staff chat, just be patient.

Sun Feb 3 7:50:25    chat        [STAFF] Ryladine Vividari (STEAM_0:1:19025450): Sonny, have you answered killer?

Sun Feb 3 7:50:26    chat        [STAFF] Sonny Corleone (STEAM_0:0:35808568): Ry can you come over here please

Sun Feb 3 7:50:30            Devon Poet (STEAM_0:0:30101464) teleported to Sonny Corleone (STEAM_0:0:35808568) (I wanna talk about this rdm thing right quick).

Sun Feb 3 7:50:32    chat        [STAFF] Sonny Corleone (STEAM_0:0:35808568): yes

Sun Feb 3 7:50:42            Ryladine Vividari (STEAM_0:1:19025450) teleported to Sonny Corleone (STEAM_0:0:35808568) (req).

Sun Feb 3 7:51:37    chat        Ryan Vance (STEAM_0:0:15264714): 'i feared for my life'

Sun Feb 3 7:52:29    chat        Ryan Vance (STEAM_0:0:15264714): i said twice for them to leave

Sun Feb 3 7:54:12    chat        [STAFF] Sonny Corleone (STEAM_0:0:35808568): jesus rollerblading christ....

Sun Feb 3 7:55:11    misc        Brenden P (STEAM_0:0:52182769) approved a search warrant for Ryan Vance (STEAM_0:0:15264714) reason: Search!

Sun Feb 3 7:55:50    chat        [STAFF] Sonny Corleone (STEAM_0:0:35808568): I'm losing patience

Sun Feb 3 7:55:58            Devon Poet (STEAM_0:0:30101464) teleported to Sonny Corleone (STEAM_0:0:35808568) (Stuck).

Sun Feb 3 7:56:40            Baku Enenra (STEAM_0:1:41544817) teleported to Sonny Corleone (STEAM_0:0:35808568) (?).

Sun Feb 3 7:56:56            Ryladine Vividari (STEAM_0:1:19025450) gagged Sonny Corleone (STEAM_0:0:35808568) (enough).

Sun Feb 3 7:56:59            Ryladine Vividari (STEAM_0:1:19025450) gagged Ryan Vance (STEAM_0:0:15264714) (enough).

Sun Feb 3 7:57:24    chat        Sonny Corleone (STEAM_0:0:35808568): I tried

Sun Feb 3 7:57:31    chat        Ryan Vance (STEAM_0:0:15264714): dnt sell to me? srsly

Sun Feb 3 7:57:34    chat        Sonny Corleone (STEAM_0:0:35808568): dur duh durrrr hur hurrrhdr

Sun Feb 3 7:57:35    chat        Ryan Vance (STEAM_0:0:15264714): what if he is only gd

Sun Feb 3 7:57:44    chat        Ryan Vance (STEAM_0:0:15264714): im not going to be handicapped becuz of his actions

Sun Feb 3 7:57:59            Sonny Corleone (STEAM_0:0:35808568) ungagged Sonny Corleone (STEAM_0:0:35808568).

Sun Feb 3 7:58:02            Ryladine Vividari (STEAM_0:1:19025450) ungagged Ryan Vance (STEAM_0:0:15264714).

Sun Feb 3 7:58:11            Ryladine Vividari (STEAM_0:1:19025450) teleported Sonny Corleone (STEAM_0:0:35808568) to spawn (Go).

ki113r45 · (This post was last modified: 02-04-2013 08:47 AM by ki113r45.)

My side: When i went to Sonny to talk they where both there arguing and when Ryladine went there Troll and Sonny both where given their chance to tell the story while they proceded to argued i couldn't hear much cause one would say the other was wrong and vice versa, they where at each others necks the entire time while being questioned by Ryladine but from what i heard Sonny killed Troll for "Fearing for his life" after Troll shot the two trespassers, Sonny then thinking hes going to be robbed shot Troll and was therefore stuck in his house. Remember this is just what i got from 10 minutes of arguing back and forth from them im not sure if this is what i heard but im pretty sure it was.
EDIT: I remember Sonny asking why he would just rdm Troll and Troll responded "Just because your Sonny you would"

Mernimbler · 02-04-2013, 10:38 AM

Does this mean now whenever somebody gets shot, absolutely anybody nearby could turn around and shoot the murder with the reason, 'I feared for my life'?

That doesn't seem that logical. Same reason why pulling a gun out while being mugged is no longer allowed. RP reasons.

Sonny · 02-04-2013, 11:40 AM

(02-04-2013 10:38 AM)Mernimbler Wrote: Does this mean now whenever somebody gets shot, absolutely anybody nearby could turn around and shoot the murder with the reason, 'I feared for my life'?

That doesn't seem that logical. Same reason why pulling a gun out while being mugged is no longer allowed. RP reasons.

I had been trying to leave and I was confined in a small aread. If it had been on the street, I would not have killed him. The only reason I killed him was because I was locked in a small area and I got scared.

bloop · (This post was last modified: 02-04-2013 11:48 AM by bloop.)

(02-04-2013 10:38 AM)Mernimbler Wrote: Same reason why pulling a gun out while being mugged is no longer allowed. RP reasons.

Actually it is allowed don't know where your pulling this from. Also this should have been handled by Ryladine then and there "fearing for your life" is a bullshit reason to kill someone especially when he was having you leave his house. It's not like he turned around and said hey get in that corner or some shit no he was letting you out.

troll · 02-04-2013, 12:46 PM

(02-04-2013 11:40 AM)Sonny Wrote:
(02-04-2013 10:38 AM)Mernimbler Wrote: Does this mean now whenever somebody gets shot, absolutely anybody nearby could turn around and shoot the murder with the reason, 'I feared for my life'?

That doesn't seem that logical. Same reason why pulling a gun out while being mugged is no longer allowed. RP reasons.

I had been trying to leave and I was confined in a small aread. If it had been on the street, I would not have killed him. The only reason I killed him was because I was locked in a small area and I got scared.

I was holding the door open for you, and also the cp/citizen were blocking the only way to leave... so being in a small area has no factor. I was leading you out. You were also behind me.

**Taco Bell** · 02-04-2013, 02:19 PM

(02-04-2013 12:46 PM)troll Wrote:
(02-04-2013 11:40 AM)Sonny Wrote:
(02-04-2013 10:38 AM)Mernimbler Wrote: Does this mean now whenever somebody gets shot, absolutely anybody nearby could turn around and shoot the murder with the reason, 'I feared for my life'?

That doesn't seem that logical. Same reason why pulling a gun out while being mugged is no longer allowed. RP reasons.

I had been trying to leave and I was confined in a small aread. If it had been on the street, I would not have killed him. The only reason I killed him was because I was locked in a small area and I got scared.

I was holding the door open for you, and also the cp/citizen were blocking the only way to leave... so being in a small area has no factor. I was leading you out. You were also behind me.

Yea, so even if he was getting shot or something Troll would be hit first. So, I don't see why you shot him. That's a stupid reason to shoot someone. "I was feared for my life." If that was the case, everyone would be using that. Think how many Rdm's would happen, if everyone would say this. You think admin is going to believe him. I don't think so. We all know you hate Troll but that still didn't give you the right to shoot him. Just because you wanted to kill him because maybe you were mad at something and you wanted to take you anger out on troll. That's a stupid excuse....

Wazzy · 02-05-2013, 07:59 AM

If you haven't got anything to contribute as evidence, don't post Taco.

**Taco Bell** · 02-05-2013, 12:31 PM

(02-05-2013 07:59 AM)Wazzy Wrote: If you haven't got anything to contribute as evidence, don't post Taco.

I'm just putting my input in as long as with bloop. He has no evidence....

Wazzy · (This post was last modified: 02-05-2013 12:39 PM by Wazzy.)

Your input is your opinion, that of which you have worded in an offensive manner. Don't post unless you have something further to contribute to the discussion, rather than making assumptions and criticising Sonny for motives that I doubt even crossed his mind once.

Burnacid · (This post was last modified: 02-05-2013 05:14 PM by Burnacid.)

So i spoke to rylidine who told me he didn't take actions ingame because of the lack of evidence. Both parties were telling complete different stories.

So what i can make from your 2 stories is that you were both in a small store. Troll shot 2 people who were trespassing or not leaving on request. Sonny felt threatened and killed troll.

I have no idea of what really happened to the second so i would have to do some ruff justice.
Could you kill someone because you "fear for your life"?

I would say no, in darkRP 80% of players walks around with a gun. Does this mean i can kill everyone because i fear they are going to shoot me? no. So in general what has been done is not allowed.

But in this case, is good RP voiding the rule or are any other rules in effect. Well i don't know. He might have been hit in crossfire. You might have shot in his general direction. In those cases the "i feared for my life" would be allowed. Yet because of the lack of evidence i can't determent whether this happened or not.

So the main question, is this abuse? i would say in general yes to the "i feared for my life" but because of the lack of evidence on the current situation i can't make that decision.

Report closed